News

Have your say on bin bag service

By Laura Herbert
September 04, 2012

Households are being urged to have their say on how the borough’s controversial new waste and recycling service is working.

The scheme, which came into force in April, was initially criticised as many households were given the wrong size blue bin bags and many felt they were too flimsy.

Families were also upset about the 80 bag limit forced on them by the council.

The consultation, which launched on Tuesday, August 21, aims to find out whether users think the service is running as intended.

Councillor Angus Ross, executive member for environment at Wokingham Borough Council, said: “It would be fair to say that we had a few initial problems when we launched the new service.

“Four months in, I am pleased to report good progress is being made.

“The amount of household waste sent for disposal has reduced by 21 per cent compared with the same period last year and recycling has increased by 32 per cent over the same period and this is all down to the efforts of our residents.

“This means we are on track to meet our budget target of saving nearly a million pounds in the first year, but just as importantly, we are avoiding landfill penalties and contributing to the environment by sending more for recycling.”

Cllr Ross added: “Our citizen’s panel have received copies of the survey along with members of the public who raised concerns with us over the past four months, but we want to hear from as many local residents as possible.

“This new service affected everyone and we are keen to learn more about their experiences and how the scheme is working.”

The survey asks about the blue waste sacks, including suitability, kerbside recycling scheme, the recycling rewards scheme and the opt-in garden waste scheme.

Visit www.wokingham.gov.uk/council/consultations/wasteservices to complete the survey by Friday, September 14.

The results will be reported to the executive later this year and will help improve the service next year.

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Most recent user comments 34 of 34

Yup Windsor and Maidenhead. I took the 77K as a best case, though of course there's evidence that this rises after time. Who knows what the real cost is? It could be lower, however I doubt that it's 'an exciting, new free council recycling programme' as per WBC's website.

Woky Local
05/09/2012 at 13:58

Those figures are from Windsor's scheme though, right - not WBC?

It's not a 77k annual cost though, is it - it says '77k rising to 144k'....

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
05/09/2012 at 13:49

To me, a flat rate is a flat rate. The 77K looks like an annual cost. Remmeber though, these are unverified costs plucked from the interweb so they realy should only be used as an example that free doesn't always mean free. The cost could be hidden in the charge from Veolia to WBC. My point being that we don't have decent numbers to crunch so there's guesswork and speculation to be had.

Woky Local
05/09/2012 at 13:46

Thanks Woky Local. any idea if that flat rate of '77k rising to 144k' is per annum, per month, per week, per 100 tonnes... And that quote suggests two sets of fees - "One of the first costs is a subscription to RecycleBank" and "One of the main costs for the council in adopting the scheme would be in paying RecycleBank itself to administer the scheme". Ambiguous. Could our council not simply have said 'it costs X per year, plus Y per tonne, whereas it used to cost Z per year'?

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
05/09/2012 at 12:54

Source: http://www.letsrecycle.com/news/special-reports/recyclebank-what-will-it-cost

'One of the first costs is a subscription to RecycleBank to operate the rewards system on their behalf, this can be done in either a ‘flat-rate' of an annual subscription or it can be calculated on landfill diversion.'

'One of the main costs for the council in adopting the scheme would be in paying RecycleBank itself to administer the scheme, with Windsor and Maidenhead currently paying a flat rate of £77,000 to RecycleBank for 2010/11, rising to £144,000 over the course of 2011/12. Halton also pays a flat rate for the scheme, although the exact costs have not been divulged.'

£77K = 1283 Green waste bins for a year.

Woky Local
05/09/2012 at 12:39

Woky Local - You are right, we should question them. As long as it is constructive and not just having a moan. I hope we all want the same thing....To make Woky the best place to live and receive value for money on our Council Tax payments.

Great quote to find from Gary Cowan. Certainly suggests that whoever won the contract (Veolia in this case) had to run an incentive scheme either by themselves or through a partnership similar to Maidenheads.

I P Freely
05/09/2012 at 10:44

IP.... Agree with you that WBC will take a beating one way or another however don't you think we should question them every now and again to keep them honest?

'Councillor Gary Cown, ........ added that the incentive scheme costs were built into the contract, revealing: “we put a condition in the tender saying that we expected them to deliver some form of incentive scheme.”'

Source: http://www.letsrecycle.com/news/latest-news/councils/recyclebank-scheme-to-be-introduced-in-wokingham

So, I believe there are costs..... not to mention the lost revenue from those traders opting into the scheme. How much has the Carnival Pool lost out by accepting 'Free Child' swimming vouchers at £3.10 a time?

Woky Local
05/09/2012 at 10:29

Woky Local - The official line is that wheelie bins are not suitable for the Borough and would mean that it would have to move to a fortnightly collection not just because they look unsightly. The council wanted it to remain weekly so opted for the blue bags which also give an extra 100 or so litres compared to wheelie bins (so long as you got the correct size that is!)

Recyclebank is an external company that started in America. It is seperate to the council and they are not paying them for it. Recyclebank get offers from companies for discounts to run on their site and also your personal details so I am sure most of their revenue would be ad based. The fact you also have to call them each week would bring in some as well I would guess

Mistwalker
05/09/2012 at 10:18

Ohj for goodness sake, what does it matter what we think WDC will do exactly what they want. I am still waiting for the 'right size of bags' to be delivered which I was promised back in April. Why would anyone want to throw away unused bags? Why not give them to their neighbours who are fining the restricted number of bags a problem - how thoughtless is that? I have spoken to my neighbour and told her to fill my bags if hers are full - easy. Just a little thought and communication between neighbours, that is all that is needed.

As for the garden waste, now that I do have a problem with. Why not continue the green bags? It was easy to use. I have seen so many people dumping their garden waste around the South Lake area and in High Wood it is a disgrace. I myself take it to the tip but I am lucky and have a car, what about the older people?

A little more thought I think WDC but I am speaking from Woodley and we seem to be the 'poor relation' to WDC - again. To be honest WDC just takes our money and does very little for Woodley.

Me-Here, Woodley
05/09/2012 at 10:16

I guess WBC are in a no win situation. Ask what people think of the scheme so far - they get battered. Don't ask what people think - They get battered.

When a change to a service affects all 60,000+ properties in the Borough it's not going to be popular with everyone. Particularly if you could get rid of as much waste pre April 2012 without a care to where it went and no need to recycle. Where as now it is being controlled you do have to care about how much rubbish you produce. Not many people are going to welcome this new scheme with open arms.

Woky Local - Sorry to disappoint but I beleive Recyclebank is free to WBC and its users. It's already come up before on here that Recyclebank make their money through advertising on the website and probably selling on data to marketing companies. I look forward to seeing the results of your FOI on here in 20 working days as I'm not sure if anyone has the 'offcial' answer. Maybe you could kill 2 birds with one stone and ask about the tonnage of waste received so far compared to last year. It might save Damiano Tommassi some time?

Phil - Can you take your petty and personal spat against Keith Baker somewhere else and bore off?

I P Freely
05/09/2012 at 10:14

Wheelie bins are not suitable for everyone. For example, we live on the side of a hill with no space at the front of the house to store them unless we permanently restrict the pavement with them. Can't imagine trying to manoevure a fully laden wheelie bin down steps at the side of the house on collection day. Bags are a lot easier in this respect.

Fed up, Lower Earley
05/09/2012 at 10:01

I wonder how much non-recycleable plastic is now going in the recycling boxes ? I bet it's gone up a lot since there became a limit on waste.

Would Leigh
05/09/2012 at 09:52

MoL... We can't have bins because they look untidy is the official line we're being fed, with the exception of the huge brown bins used for the green waste service..... Though you could argue that a ripped-open bag looks much worse. Woky Times could write a good piece based on a big ole Freedom Of Information request. I for one would like to know the cost of running the recyclebank scheme - and don't tell me it's free. Nothing is free.

Woky Local
05/09/2012 at 09:14

It appears that Cllr Keith Baker has lost his metaphoric tongue - the discussions on this website are all the poorer - at least he used to have a go at defending the indefensible.

Phil Challis, woodley
04/09/2012 at 20:22

Simple question....... If they want less waste why put rubbish in blue sacks which the refuse collectors place in a wheelie bin and empty that into the collection vehicle. Surely a wheelie bin supplied once to each household as in the Reading area and there would be no need for any further plastic sacks which do not rot down. Or is that just too easy !!!!

Man of leisure, Woodley
04/09/2012 at 16:57

It also misses the point, largely. My main objection to this scheme is the 'stealth tax' argument allied with a proud council telling us that council tax hadn't gone up. On top of that, the lack of data for us to review means that we only have their word to take, and as we all know you can prove anything with statistics/make them fit your agenda.

Show us some stats please, WBC, and you can blow all my cynicism out of the water. Unless...

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 16:35

The questionnaire was definitely written in a way to make sure that WBC scored highly. One of my first reactions after completing it was that the questions were loaded so you couldn't be to critical or shoot them down. I did leave some scathing comments, but I suspect WBC will still come out of it smelling of roses.

Steven
04/09/2012 at 16:20

Woky, I see what you mean... the first few pages looked good (grammar aside), and then suddenly things like "Were you aware before the start of the new scheme that you could mix your recycling in the same box?". I wasn't aware of that BEFORE the scheme - where's my option for that?

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 15:45

Anyone else completed the consultation document and think it's written in such a way as to score points for WBC?

Oh, and the question "Did you know that you can put a blue bag in your existing 80L dustbin to prevent Tasmanian Cat Devils from ripping open the bag?"....... Yes, I know this...... but it's not going to happen. Food waste + animals ripping bags open = fantastic place to live thank you WBC.

Woky Local
04/09/2012 at 15:22

DT:

I wouldn't wipe my backside on the DM.

Europe does want to do away with nation states, hence the regionalisation of our country. We are region K of the North Atlantic group of regions as listed on the EUSSR's own website. We are disignated a region for agriculture and service industries......Please look it up if you doubt me.

I am of an age where sticks and stones etc.....It doesn't bother me whether some one calls me names or implies I am this or that.

Many of the so called thought crimes came in under Labour and although they are supposed to help people live together, they actually didvide people and keep people frightened to say what they really mean. People should never have a right not to be insulted or offended.

I agree this is not the place to discuss political ideology but, the NAZIs were socialists in much the same way the BNP are: They want to renationalize many of our industries and nationalize many others......Look at their site......Take out the race element and they sound like socialists.

I have had fun.....This is my last post on this topic. Have a good day!!

Tonk, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 14:41

Hehe! oh, the irony! I think you're confusing socialism and fascism...

I'm not calling you a madman, and I apologise if my words were insulting. It's just that there were a number of points in your post that came across a little bit 'London-cabbie', if you know what I mean. I'd love the opportunity to talk them through with you and explain to you the error of your ways, but I don't think this is the place for that.

i mean, 'EUSSR'... put down the Daily Mail, it'll rot your brain!

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 14:00

That's right DT.....When you can't argue with the points, resort to insults.....It's the socialist's way!!

We both have strong opinions and that is good. In general terms, the difference between a socialist and non socialists is that socialists don't like opposition views.......I would defend your right to have your opinions and to voice them; socialists prefer to call those with differing views names, such as climate change denier etc or to criminalize the voicing of those opposite views.....That's straight out of the Frankfurt School.

I even defend your right to be offensive to me and call me a madman.....Would a socialist do the same?

Have a good day XXX

Tonk, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 13:53

Tonk, you've got a lot of strong opinions there. Most of them sound like the ramblings of a madman, but they're strong nonetheless!

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 13:27

I accept recycling is a good thing: it makes sense to do so, we live on a small planet with limited resourses. What I can never understand is why "recycled green products" are more expensive compared to those made from virgin materials. Surely most of the costs of getting the materials out of the ground or from the forest are charged for in the first cycle. Do the profiteers believe that followers of the new false religion will be happy to pay a premium for recycled products in much the same way I've paid over the odds for tat within Vatican City?

I agree with much of the green agenda, it is the way the powers to be want to force it onto everyone which is wrong and their selective use of "Green thought" which appears to be more about power and control rather than real enviromentalism. Take the Green summits in Rio etc....Why did they not practice what they preached and had tele-conferencing rather than flying delegates and the media out there? If carbon dioxide really is such an enemy, which I doubt, why do they want to add so much more of it? Is it not more a case of don't do as we do, do as you're told?

I feel more stuff could and should be recycled. I do not think that fining people to enforce the religion is right: education from a young age is far better.

People should not have to sort rubbish at home and store it, this should be done centrally.

Governments should not have allowed a foreign, unelected power to impose fines on us for putting our own waste into our own land. (EUSSR) I notice the lefties are pro the EUSSR and non lefties are, in general, opposed to the EUSSR. Isn't it funny that the leftie EUSSR are also the main font of the new false religion's diktats.

Tonk, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 13:17

Socialism is not a good thing: it does not reward effort so people stop trying and everything just festers. Socialism NEVER aims to raise people up, it always drags people down.

Regarding climate change and religion.

There is still much debate regarding the causes of climate which has always changed. The windmills....or rotating crosses as I prefer to call them, are basically just a symbol. When looked at in detail, windmills, along with most other so caleed renewables, are not that green. The reason I call it a religion is because it relies on fath to accept it, rather than hard proven, checkable, science. Computer models don't show exactly what happens in the real world and statistics have been manipulated to say the least. Left leaning media have taken the former government's line that the science is proven, which it is not, and will not debate it. So called deniers are silenced, including those that you would expect to be very keen on protecting the enviroment: Dr David Bellamy for example. He denied CC and is now never on TV.

It is also odd that, in the main, the lefties support the new false religion whereas, non lefties don't: that suggests it more about ideological matters rather than hard science.

Tonk, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 13:01

There is bound to be more recycling now the service has become weekly.

I used to fill up my 2 bins for recycling every two weeks and anything left over went out with the rest of the rubbish. So that begs the question why was the recycling restricted for so many years - answer of course the decision was made by Councilllors.

Are these councillors now trying to say the recycling has increased because they have reduced the amount of other waste they collect. It is not possible to link the two.

The council do not take into account what we personally take to recycling centres like Bracknell and smallmead. All they talk about is what they collect. If they increased the amount of garden waste they take they could pat themselves on the back and say how much extra is sent for recycling.

There should be a poll are politicians stupid or do they think we are stupid - in both cases the majority would probably answer yes to both questions - and with good reason!

come on lads
04/09/2012 at 13:01

Oh and the alleyway that is slowly filling up with grass cutting!

bigking, The Moon
04/09/2012 at 12:31

There is a bin near my house at the entrance to a park, it has been there for years and I don't remember it ever overflowing with rubbish. In the past 4 months it is constantly accompanied by 4 or 5 full black bags awaiting the 'free' council collection.

However you are correct that people in my little close do now put out less rubbish for the weekly blue bag collection!!

bigking, The Moon
04/09/2012 at 12:29

Hats - that's explain the '21 % reduction' in waste sent to landfill; it's scattered across our streets and dwindling green spaces!

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 11:17

It has added to my waste that can't be recycled. At the end of the year I will have about forty blue bags that I don't need and which I will throw into the non-recyclable waste.

PoneRana, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 11:16

This - "For what it's worth: my view is that this whole bin sceme is about saving the council money and increasing its revenue stream"

Not sure about the points on socialism though... firstly because socialism is a good thing in principle (it's only the humans that ruin it!) and second because scientific evidence for a warming planet is just fact, surely... I've never met anyone for whom climate change is a religion, not even close. But I think we all agree that waste is a crime and landfills are not a solution to our problems, so recycling is a good thing.

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 11:16

Absolutely anecodatal I know, but I walk down to the station early every morning before the bags are collected, and blue bin bags ripped open with scattered contents by foxes/cats/tasmanian devils or whatever seem far more prevalent than was the case with black bin bags. Realise that is hardly a double-blind controlled scientific study, but it is a very strong impression.

HatsOfDoom
04/09/2012 at 11:16

Ding Ding Round Ten,

In the Red Corner, we have those that say; "I recycle everything and I want to force you to do the same."

In the Blue Corner, we have those that say this bin policy is a new stealth tax and way around the government's "no rise in rip off tax" policy.

This match will be a stalemate. We do need detailed figures as DT states above but, they will not be forthcoming.

Another point is that no one believes a word that comes out of a politician's mouth these days and we all know that figures and statistics can be manipulated to prove anything people want them to.

For what it's worth: my view is that this whole bin sceme is about saving the council money and increasing its revenue stream. I am sure that the watermelons (green on the outside but red on the inside) will keep peddling the new false religion until they get global socialism. Even a former French President admitted that the new false religion of climate change, will be a great way to achieve a global socialist government. I am only pleased that I should be dead before that comes fully into being.

Tonk, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 10:59

I want to see the raw results first, please. Some councillor saying 'reduced 21% over the period' means nothing to me - show me figures I can look at and do the maths on myself.

Damiano_Tommassi, Wokingham
04/09/2012 at 09:59

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